Third Race Design

Alright guys, from what I can tell, just about everyone here agrees on having a third race once the game is in a more clean, balanced state. However, I haven't seen much direction on what the new race should be like.

With that in mind, I suggest we begin brainstorming. I know much of the core team is devoted to other projects at the moment, and that's awesome, but that doesn't prevent the rest of us from throwing down some preliminary ideas of what we're looking for in a third race.

I've added a poll to get an idea of what kind of race people have in mind - the suggestions there are just that, suggestions, and are intended to identify the playstyle of the race more than the actual heritage, but it wouldn't be a bad idea to begin thinking about that as well (we don't want to completely violate the lore by throwing in the Borg from Star Trek for example).

For reference, I'm using the mostly-agreed-upon Factions Map for the Homeworld Universe. It isn't canon, strictly speaking, but as I understand it most Homeworld fans see it as pretty close. You can check it out =here=.

Let the brainstorm begin!

I feel reimagining the Turanic Raiders would be a profitable venture. The Turanic Raiders canonically being feudal in nature are very resourceful. I find that their presence would still around even great due to the vaygr conflict. Also, due to their enigmatically existence this allows for an interesting exploration of their group of people.

Turanic Raiders cannot really be classified as a “race” parse as they most likely are a mixture of various cultures that united under a feudal despot like system. We see this kind of explore in HW:C with the introduction of the Outpost. In my imagination a good design direction for them is to explore the possibility of them uniting under a strong leader. I in my opinion I foresee that their system should reflect close to a Genghis Khan Era Mongol empire in their style leadership. With this you can explore interesting design concepts as well as tactics and research tree. Also, you can make more a fanon elaboration and exploration of the Turanic culture. That is my opinion and defense of my vote for the Turanic Raiders as new comers to the galactic field.

I always loved the Kadeshi in Homeworld 1 and wanted to see them, or at least a group of them return "Home!" I would like to see the Kadeshi added as an ally race for the Hiigaran. A late game reinforcement more than a new playable race.

So Progenitors, where there's no confirmation about them being extinct, won't come back, but the beast that has died centuries ago will? Same for the Bentusi, which have gone extinct in the Homeworld 2 campaign. Keepers were the last Progenitors in the current universe. But no-one has confirmed that they're still existent or that they went extinct with the Keepers.

I'm not getting that logic. xD

Odie_76 wrote:I always loved the Kadeshi in Homeworld 1 and wanted to see them, or at least a group of them return "Home!" I would like to see the Kadeshi added as an ally race for the Hiigaran. A late game reinforcement more than a new playable race.

This needs actual back story to make sense. Doesn't mean I don't like the idea, but it needs a story. And without story... New units in general are hard to add.

Well, *insert long explination and latern hang* and that is how you have the beast made. I believe Anubis forgot about them, I believe he only compelte the HW2 campaign long time ago. Personaly progenitors seem to powerful for a race. Nerfing them will get ride of the omnious and powerful feel.

bladevalant546 wrote:Well, *insert long explination and latern hang* and that is how you have the beast made. I believe Anubis forgot about them, I believe he only compelte the HW2 campaign long time ago. Personaly progenitors seem to powerful for a race. Nerfing them will get ride of the omnious and powerful feel.

You can't create something that has been gone in history. Maybe with heavy research and such, but it should really not be a thing to add the beast. I mean... It doesn't even have ships to build. Only to infect etc.

The Progs and all other unknown/extinct races, I say we should carefully think about the options of them either being alive or somewhere asleep/hidden.

I was being sarcastic as you are right concerning the Beast. It is a slippery slope when talking about unknown/extinct races. Which is why I like to stay with what we know. Also, the difficulty of adding another race is making it seem unique.

The kadeshi were never confirmed to be extinct. In the HW1 campaign, merely a few (5?) needleships were destroyed. That is absolutely not likely to have been the entire population. I'd say, the story behind their appearance could be that they simply did not have the resources to sustain their community, since everyone got to know about how dangerous the nebula is - avoiding it became a countermeasure to the raids.

Therefore the kadeshi wish to join the galactic community and settle down - or so they would have everyone believe...

Technically, backgrounds like this could be easily made up for many factions, and this designed as mini-campaign missions. But everyone needs to remember that we're a long shot from that.

I'd still go for the Keepers.

Just like to point out that I never said that they were extinct nor that their existence is unconfirmed.

Yikes, sorry I forgot to list the Progenitors, but that's who I was thinking of when I listed the Keepers.

Again, these are mostly meant to be playstyle suggestions rather than specifically those races. I figured the Progenitors, Keepers, and Bentusi would be close enough in playstyle and graphical style to list them all as one option (hence, Keepers/Bentusi).

Anyway, my vote went to the Turanic Raiders. I think that they would have unique gameplay options to really make them stand out as their own race and would add a different dimension to the game that doesn't already exist in the Higgies or Vaygr.

I, for one, would really like to see them depend on guerrilla tactics and snatch/grab type operations using something akin to salvage corvettes/Junkyard Dog.

Hmm... I prefer a back story behind a new race in multiplayer or singleplayer. I'd like it to make sense instead of just being there like: "*POOF!* We have a new race!".

ALC wrote:I'd still go for the Keepers.

I didn't vote yet at all! That was just an example that in some way could be adopted to any race. Minus Bentusi because they are dead.

Farcrada wrote:Hmm... I prefer a back story behind a new race in multiplayer or singleplayer. I'd like it to make sense instead of just being there like: "*POOF!* We have a new race!".

Yes, fully agreed - even if it's just a text note, there needs to be a back story!

Nakamura wrote:Minus Bentusi because they are dead.

Well... That's a bit harsh, isn't it?

Farcrada wrote:

Nakamura wrote:Minus Bentusi because they are dead.

Well... That's a bit harsh, isn't it?

Truth hurts.

At least they died for a better cause...

I still haven't figured out or haven't read the reason why Bentus was the last of the Bentusi. Does anyone have a link?

Farcrada wrote:At least they died for a better cause...

I still haven't figured out or haven't read the reason why Bentus was the last of the Bentusi. Does anyone have a link?

Yeah I'm with you on that - it was just like "hey we're the last lolz"

I thought the rest of them ended up leaving the galaxy at the outbreak of the Beast and Bentus was the last ship that remained in the galaxy, but I'm not entirely sure where I got that from, could be that I made it up out of thin air, lol.

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More on topic, I agree there needs to be back story, so whichever race we do decide on will probably tie in to their relevant race shown here (such as Turanic raiders coming in like vultures while the Vaygr are weakened). Even if, like Nakamura said, it's just a simple text writeup somewhere, it DOES need to tie in to be at least plausibly canon. No random introduction of Borg from Star Trek, lol.

That is the way I understood it aswell concerning Bentus.

Back to the relevance, when the third race is considered I would like to help with back stories concerning their introduction. One of my favorite past times is writing stories and plot lines even making an old Homeworld RPG at one point. I am very strict on plausibility with in the lore when it comes to race introduction, so you will have my OCD on that category.

When the time comes, it will certainly be an exciting venture.

Yes, I am really looking forward to seeing a third race come to fruition in this game. Out of all the RTSes I've played in my life, those with three races seem to have been the most engaging (with the rare exception of Homeworld games of course ). I'm not sure if that's just because they were better made than others or what have you, but for some reason having three races just seems to be the sweet spot for RTS.

I would prefer the taiidani, their ships always seemed to be more suitable and powerfull to me

err... tadaiin are a fractured kinda minor race post HW2 era, where Complex is set.

Loving the idea of bringing the progenitors back. If u think about it the higs vs the progenitor would b pretty balanced by now, after all did they not get sajuuk? If anything homeworld showed how resourceful the higs were and how quickly they would reverse engineer more advanced tech. I recently posted 2 models which I thought would make great BC and BB 4 the progenitors. I found them on the Angels Fall First mod.

Check out the link.

http://complex.mastertopforum.com/possible-progenitor-bc-bb-vp51271.html#51271

Seen it, yes. Now make up a logical story that fits in the Homeworld universe so we can introduce them. xD

BTW, Anubis, The keepers are Progenitors. And Bentusi are a race of their own. They can't possibly be merged together. And seen from in-game footage you all have seen... It indicates the Progenitors and Bentusi aren't in that big of a friendly relationship... If you know what I mean...